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STM's Random DC tidbits (or other LF2 stuff) - STM1993 - 08-19-2016

Making this thread so I can gather together a bunch of stuff I found out that aren't directly available on main site as I find them out in the process of figuring things out.

Expect them to be updated very sporadically whenever I feel like it.
Special thanks to @Silverthorn, @Ramond & @zort for helping with this guide!
Recently found out some new things thanks to 叶小六, Leaf, Crosster and Nyamaiku!

Guides I've found: - no idea who wrote this pretty good chinese DC guide @empirefantasy linked. There are a few inaccuracies, but otherwise appears to be a good guide. - excellent database containing info about LF2's inner workings.
BluePhoenix said that an LF2 frame name should not exceed 20 characters, else there'd be bugs.
LASER has a thread that also tries to explain bugs and other inner workings of LF2, albeit in chinese.

LFE's Useful Reference Pages

Last updated: 24/2/2018

Basic Mechanics
Weapons will randomly drop from sky when there are less 4 projectiles or weapons including those held in the hand) in the game.
Default itr zwidth appears to be zwidth 15, not 12 like it was originally believed.
Also, zwidth 15 means 14/1/14, NOT 7/1/7!
1. Useful HP & MP Numbers (Click to View)
2. Other HP Properties (Click to View)
3. Hitlag (Click to View)
4. Defend(state 7) and Armor (Click to View)
5. Fall & Injury (Click to View)
6. Inputs - Buffers, Errors & how it works (Click to View)
7. "Criminal" Type 5 Objects (Click to View)
8. arest & vrest properties. (Click to View)
9. Walking & Running (Click to View)

Tag Properties
Stage should be mostly up to date, but do refer to this Ratio table instead for accuracy.
For stage, x: -1000 is a magic number that makes the enemy have a 50% chance of spawning left or right.
1. Special numbers for dvx/dvy/dvz (Click to View)
2. Z-axis on cpoint, wpoint & opoint (Click to View)
3. hit_Fa homing targets (Click to View)
4. States (5,14,18,19,301) (Click to View)
5. wpoint properties (Click to View)
6. wpoint itr kind 5 + WpnStrength effect 4 special property (Click to View)
7. cpoint "decrease" tag (Click to View)
8. State 9997 - best practical method (Click to View)

Detailed ID Properties
Barring a few bits of missing information, the mainsite is pretty accurate.
id 40-49 will have missing "Com" when they appear in stage mode as if they were bandits, but they still blink when getting up.
IDs that can be blocked regardless of direction: 124(boomerang), 220(jan_chase), firzen_chasef/i(221, 222)
1. Iceball Conversion (Click to View)
2. Facts on Firen/Freeze's Fusion into Firzen (Click to View)
3. Clones - opointing a type 0 (and some AI facts) (Click to View)
4. Hardcoded ID properties with AI behavior (Click to View)

Useful Techniques
Gad's proximity checker using ik8 & a teleporting ball with an ik0 bdy
Self-Catch "Counter skill"
hit_back using hit_d & -mp tag
Cursed itr (a very big number) (-2147483648)
Pushing - throwing immediately with cpoint
AdiDidIt's weapon lift + teleport to nearest opponent system
Spawning objects in Teams other than 1 & 5 in Stage mode
Old DC Contest Thread
rewlf2's guide to making Type3/5 chars
rewlf2's State/Frame machine Guide - very handy list
hit_Forward - a mechanic I re-discovered, and then found out Leaf.F had discovered it much earlier than I did.

Other Stuff
data.txt for LF2 v2.0a
Itr Kind page
ik0 Effects page
Sounds list
John's shield, regardless of location, prevents ALL enemy AI from picking up weapons.
Milks & beers spawned in Battle Mode are independent.
When weapons are dropped by a char(due to injured falling for example) or wpoint kind 3, they randomly appear in any of the frames 0 to 5 only.
Nyamaiku said that all actions actually startup 1tu faster than the data indicates.
State 100 sadly can't be used on anything but a type 0 char.
Apparently you need to indicate the "throwinjury" tag if you want to throw an enemy with the appropriate activation of itr kind 4 in state12 frames.
You can use state12 to make yourself only hittable by fall>40 attacks, but it makes you drop your weapon and there's a chance you may go into real falling frames if you're in midair.
Weird bug when reaching object limit.
id200 has a bug when nexting into frame 212, fixable by adding a jump height tag in bmp.
1. Ramond's hypothesis about why opointing doesn't work in 1st frame (Click to View)
2. Henry's flute diagram & itr kind 11 (Click to View)
(too lazy to format)
Fall: - credits to rewlf2 for experimenting. yspeeds obtained mostly via using dvy550 property.
y-velocity required for these falling frames to trigger
Frame 180/186 = yspeed -10 or lower
Frame 181/187 = yspeed >-10
Frame 182/188 = yspeed >0 (can flip)
Frame 183/189 = yspeed >6
Frame 184/190 = (apparently unused according to rewlf2)
Frame 185/191 = (bounce)
Bounce happens when xspeed is >10 or yspeed >1. The bounce itself has a cap on its speed.
This property of state 12 & frame changing is exclusive to frames 180-191.

RE: STM's Random DC tidbits (or other LF2 stuff) - Ramond - 08-19-2016

Finally! LFE actually needed something like this since I feel there are still many secrets deep in the realm of DCing that are just waiting to be revealed.

I'm considering stickying this once we get a handful of interesting stuff.

RE: STM's Random DC tidbits (or other LF2 stuff) - Gad - 08-19-2016

I've also thought about spawning an object #objA over character and a second #objB that teleports to closest foe or ally. Then itr and by with y=-999999 checks if they are close enough either on axis z or x. If objA is destroyed by objB it spawns smthn that continues an attack. That itr could also check if enemy is in specified distance.

Not that random but one more condition to go.

RE: STM's Random DC tidbits (or other LF2 stuff) - STM1993 - 09-23-2016

Bump because I've added a number of lesser-known things since the first time thread was posted.

You might find the bit on homing property & clones having mp150 particularly interesting, and for those who can read chinese (or don't mind using google translate) there's a link to a chinese DC page @empirefantasy linked to.

Credits to zort for pointing out how many glugs it takes to drink a milk, and BluePhoenix for helping to confirm the HP heal values - natural, state1700, itr kind 8, Jan heal, milk & beer!

RE: STM's Random DC tidbits (or other LF2 stuff) - You'rHighness - 09-23-2016

Thanks man! this will help me alot on my MOD.but i hope an english lang pattern.

RE: STM's Random DC tidbits (or other LF2 stuff) - empirefantasy - 09-23-2016

I have to mention that firzen have a higher Dark-Red HP difference when he is fused. I think that becaouse of sum of firen and freeze HP colors.

RE: STM's Random DC tidbits (or other LF2 stuff) - STM1993 - 11-04-2016

* Added some extra links for easier reference to mainsite material.
* Some reformatting so that post is easier to reference.
* Added stage HP recover amount formula.
* Added some extra info on hitlag.
* Heavily updated armor/defend/fall with much more detailed & accurate information, including facing direction. Espcially fall & injury.
* Rewrote the dvx/dvy/dvz section.
* Lumped together the state discoveries.
* Fixed a misleading info on Rudolf clones' MP recovering between stages.
* Added a section for wpoint special properties.
* Clarified what itr kind 11 actually does in the Henry flute diagram.
That's all I can remember off the top of my head.

Some of the mainsite articles have been updated, so I figure they can be worth linking, or at least for people who want to reference things.

I haven't fully explored hit_Fa properties, but it seems like when I summoned Bat's bats with his special hit_Fa and removed any homing in frame 0, the bats will still go after random targets when they return to a frame that has homing. Something I might investigate in time I guess.

I also found out that apparently, if you held back rather than pressed D during -mp tag, the game seems to treat the frame you go to as if you were using "next" rather than a 1st frame of an input, so when I modified Firen's D>J to opoint an explosion in the stop_run frame, if I pressed D to cancel it won't work, but if I held back I'd explode. This seems to tie in with Ramond's hypothesis about how frames go into next or something.

30th December 2016:
I compiled a Ratio table using Excel spreadsheet. It turns out Crazy isn't actually x2, and not even x1.8. I bruteforced the Crazy numbers to come up with this table:
[Image: uXYPzlw.png]

RE: STM's Random DC tidbits (or other LF2 stuff) - STM1993 - 06-10-2017


Main updates I can remember adding the past months are:
* Criminal type 5 info.
* State 7 on a Ball info.
* wpoint + effect 4 forced injury frame.
* arest & vrest properties - notably Nyamaiku's randomness by arest, YinYin's sweet spot on Clide, and arest+vrest double-hit.
* Quick mention of how id200 & 211 seem to have hardcoded abilities to affect AI.
* Quick mention by Nyamaiku that all moves actions actually startup 1tu faster than the data would indicate.

RE: STM's Random DC tidbits (or other LF2 stuff) - Nyamaiku - 06-10-2017

(06-10-2017, 04:58 PM)STM1993 Wrote:  * Quick mention by Nyamaiku that all moves actually startup 1tu faster than the data would indicate.

not just moves, just first frame of every action, for example frame 60 (punch), 210 (jump) etc.
frames lead from hit_a, hit_fa etc will also get a 1tu discount.

RE: STM's Random DC tidbits (or other LF2 stuff) - STM1993 - 06-07-2018

Discovered a new DC tech!!!
[Image: wtf17-3.gif]
Char has itr kind 1 (hold >)
Ball has state 16 (stun state)
in order to make sure you can catch your own ball, simply spawn the ball to face the opposite direction. (opoint facing: 1)

What does this mean?

hold_forward is now a viable charging input for LF2!

(edit: turns out Fantasy.Leaf ( @Leaf.F ) actually found this tech much earlier than I did)