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+--- Thread: Messing with negative fall/bdefend (/showthread.php?tid=4553)
Messing with negative fall/bdefend - Alblaka - 03-04-2010
Actually my idea for my defense-based char was quite simple:
In his defend frames he summons a T3 to hit himself with NEGATIVE fall & bdefend values.
In theory this should INCREASE his fall and bdefend points, in fact it would take more hits to break his defense (>broken defense frames).
But actually the T3 DECREASES his defense, now just ONE punch is ned to break the defense (same which values i take for fall/bdefend).
And to increase ridicolousity the char keeps defending (no dmg, defend sound) while doing the broken defense stance (stumbling backwards) and after about a total of 3 hits (which is the casual number ned to break defense) he goes over to injury frames...
Is somebody out there who has a good knowledge about how the fall/bdefend system works exactly?
RE: Messing with negative fall/bdefend - Bamboori - 03-04-2010
never looked at yinyin's skullmark?
RE: Messing with negative fall/bdefend - Alblaka - 03-04-2010
(03-04-2010, 09:10 PM)Bamboori Wrote: never looked at yinyin's skullmark?
Never heard of and i just searched for terms like "bdefend"...
Downloaded it and checking it ^^
nvm, Yinyin used a ueber-negative fall, making him unstunable. But i want a char that ONLY has an strogner defence...
Thought about replacing the broken-defense frames, but that would cause enemies to keep punching him like a sandbag without effect...
Gah, whatever values i try, the result is random, but never whatever i exspect. I'm going do replace the broken_defense with casual defense frames, adding a mp-drain...
Then he could defend against weak hits for unlimited time, but would loose mp while doing so.
I matched the solution from above with a 2-frames time zone where he is NOT defending... in fact you CAN break the defense with attacking him slightly faster then casual punches can... So f.E. with 2 people or special attacks.
My problem is quite solved, but i would still like to get another possible solution, regarding negative bdefend values etc...
RE: Messing with negative fall/bdefend - JossuaDC - 03-04-2010
Short. Messy. Badly written.
Deal with it.
The defend frames opoint a ball which replaces the character's regular bdy.
The ball loops for a short period of time (to prevent everlasting empty shadows).
-If the ball is hit, it will automatically enter the hitting/hit frames, in which a timer is placed to reduce the ball's hp.
-If the ball is destroyed (hit_d: (iirc) tag of the timer leads to a frame which does this), catch the character and force it into the broken_defend stage.
-If the defend frame ends before the ball is destroyed, it will react to a special bdy of the character(ik:8) and disappear (next: 1000).
Basically, if the opponent hits the ball often enough, the ball will destroy itself and send your character to the broken_defend frames.
If the wait: value of your defend frame expires before the ball is 'broken', the ball will react to a remote bdy (placed in standing/beginning of a move frames) and disappear.
Get it?
RE: Messing with negative fall/bdefend - Bamboori - 03-04-2010
better use yinyin's technique with small hp armour.
balls cant follow you on y-axis.
@below: ooops seems that i misunderstood hacker. i thought he wanted this defend state the whole time^^
RE: Messing with negative fall/bdefend - JossuaDC - 03-04-2010
(03-04-2010, 09:45 PM)Bamboori Wrote: better use yinyin's technique with small hp armour.Why would a character move on the y-axis in a defend frame?
balls cant follow you on y-axis.
Edit: This is about defend techniques, right? If you're looking for armour, just download Jisenko (or YinYin's Julio) and mess about in the .dat files.
RE: Messing with negative fall/bdefend - Alblaka - 03-04-2010
(03-04-2010, 09:43 PM)JossuaDC Wrote: Short. Messy. Badly written.
Deal with it.
The defend frames opoint a ball which replaces the character's regular bdy.
The ball loops for a short period of time (to prevent everlasting empty shadows).
If ball is hit, it will automatically enter the hitting/hit frames, in which a timer is placed to reduce the ball's hp.
-If the ball is destroyed (hit_d: (iirc) tag of the timer leads to a frame which does this), catch the character and force it into the broken_defend stage.
-If the defend frame ends before the ball is destroyed, it will react to a special bdy of the character(ik:8) and disappear (next: 1000).
Basically, if the opponent hits the ball often enough, the ball will destroy itself and send your character to the broken_defend frames.
If the wait: value of your defend frame expires before the ball is 'broken', the ball will react to a remote bdy (placed in standing/beginning of a move frames) and disappear.
Get it?
The idea is quite good.
But actually there are a few problems left:
A state 3005 will immeadeantly break the defense (correct) but don't hit the char (just send him to broken-defense, so an uebersuperenergyball would be blocked).
The T3's hp will decrease regarding on the dealt damage... not the actual bdefend-power of the attack.
Last there could be following bug: Enemy hits "char" a couple of times. Nothing happens. Then suddenly he jumps to broken frames (T3 survived, but then lost last hp due to hit_a, without being further hit).
In total a nice idea... but not exactly what i looked for (though i'm dunnoing whether a defense-increase with negative hit is even possible).
edit: Double ninja'ed x.x *Seppuku*
Anyways, i'm NOT looking for an armor technique... Actually the char DOES have an armor move, but that is some other story ^^
RE: Messing with negative fall/bdefend - JossuaDC - 03-04-2010
(03-04-2010, 09:50 PM)Alblaka Wrote: A state 3005 will immeadeantly break the defense (correct) but don't hit the char (just send him to broken-defense, so an uebersuperenergyball would be blocked).Why state: 3005? You need to use state: 3000 for the hit/hitting frames to work correctly.
(Don't whine about the shadow. It should perfectly overlap the character's shadow.)
(03-04-2010, 09:50 PM)Alblaka Wrote: The T3's hp will decrease regarding on the dealt damage... not the actual bdefend-power of the attack.So what? It's the same deal with the regular LF2.
Deep needs two slashes, Davis needs 3 punches.
(03-04-2010, 09:50 PM)Alblaka Wrote: Last there could be following bug: Enemy hits "char" a couple of times. Nothing happens. Then suddenly he jumps to broken frames (T3 survived, but then lost last hp due to hit_a, without being further hit).The hit/hitting frames should be short and so should be the timer.
You can even write an even more customisable timer by eliminating the hit_a: and replacing it with a second ball which hits the first with a state: 18 attack.
Seriously.
RE: Messing with negative fall/bdefend - Alblaka - 03-04-2010
(03-04-2010, 09:57 PM)JossuaDC Wrote: Why state: 3005? You need to use state: 3000 for the hit/hitting frames to work correctly.
(Don't whine about the shadow. It should perfectly overlap the character's shadow.)
So what? It's the same deal with the regular LF2.
Deep needs two slashes, Davis needs 3 punches.
The hit/hitting frames should be short and so should be the timer.
You can even write an even more customisable timer by eliminating the hit_a: and replacing it with a second ball which hits the first with a state: 18 attack.
Hmmm, i though you meant i'm supposed to use a state 3005 (casually unbreakable), loosing hp on each hit and THEREFORE going to the end frames.
@Deep thingy: But not because Deep deals more damage, but because Deep has a higher FALL/BDEFEND value... which doesn't matter for T3's
I think, the problem is, you can only "count hits" or calculate injury-damage with the balls, but if you get hit by a stun move (besides of the baseball the regular LF II doesn't have such moves) which uses high-fall/bdefend hits without much damage, the defense wouldn't be working as it shoul.
RE: Messing with negative fall/bdefend - JossuaDC - 03-04-2010
But you're looking for a stronger defend frame, right?
Either way, I can't help you.
Care to explain post ID #77314?
How do you prevent the 'unstoppable' thing from happening (activating the negative fall/bdefend too much)?
I love the defend-mp technique, by the way. Clever. Simple.