[C] Walker - 2.08

[支倉凍砂]

Also to me that animation looks like a kick too ...

It got some deceptive looks:

Spoiler (Click to View)

How about adding this feature to the phantom dash and making the Louis throw the ending to it.

I did just a little experimenting on this and I didn't get it to work to well, so I've put in on hold.


Did some major changes now, I hope and believe you will find at least some of them to your liking.
I did rename some moves as the Phantom-moves-are-on-the-ground and Spectre-moves-are-in-the-air doesn't work now that I implemented that teleporting kick as an air move instead (and without the telporting).

• Phantom Dash (PD)
  
• Ghost Punch (GP)
  
• Spooky Guard (SG)
  
• Spectre Kick (SK)
  
• Wraith kick (WK)
  

is what I'm going with for now. If you have any suggestions for less cheesy names I'm all ears.
Also, with the change to the jump attack, it is not Jump Strong Attack (JS) instead of Jump Kick.

I must say, with the better looking and better working uppercut, the character as a whole feels a lot better.
The removal of Spectre Punch and the new jump attack also feels rather good.
Your suggestion for run attack also works good, though it probably needs it dvxs properly aligned.

Added some sound random sound effects to moves so you get some audio response when doing special moves. They are not at all final.


As always, comments and critique is much welcomed!

[YinYin]

Also to me that animation looks like a kick too ...

It got some deceptive looks

Yeah. Still cannot really see whether that black streak is created by his arm,leg or sword. The legs still make most sense because they are the largest black area on him, the arms wouldn't have that reach and a sword slash should definitely look different.

If you have any suggestions for less cheesy names I'm all ears.

No. Cheesy is good.

[支倉凍砂]

The black streak starts where his hand is the frame before and it is located on his Punch button not Kick button, which is enough for me to be convinced that he does it with his hand. Regarding the reach, think of it as an energy wave maybe?

By the way, I forgot to put it in the post up there, but there is a download link for 2.05 in the thread opening post.

[YinYin]

The black streak starts where his hand is the frame before and it is located on his Punch button not Kick button, which is enough for me to be convinced that he does it with his hand.

That makes sense for the player then. I just don't know the game.

By the way, I forgot to put it in the post up there, but there is a download link for 2.05 in the thread opening post.

Oh.

2.05
2014-03-29

Download Link: https://www.dropbox.com/s/mksewzlpa3abn6....05%5D.rar

The 3 run attack punches are very risky with the auto linking, better have the player connect them manually by pressing attack.

The aerial punching seems to be starting with a hurt frame that doesn't fit very well into the animation. And while the new jump attack follows very well onto the D^A (I like how you can turn and punch him back) putting two extra punches in between doesn't push the opponent far enough.

The D^A itself looks better now, but he pulls his arm back to his body way too soon to stay stiff in the last frame until he lands. Maybe increase the wait on some of the frames so the animation is better distributed over the whole jump.

The dash attacks rest is too low and the knock down property seems weird. If you dash attack Louis it will first hit his armor and then knock him straight to the ground. Better give it a forward momentum, the same direction as the dash itself.

Phantom Dash controls great now. At such high speed you should try to adjust the catching itr as precisely as possible as you sometimes catch your opponent from behind, which makes you turn.
Also the throw and the distance could use some adjustment. If you perform two in a row you will currently get hit by the thrown opponent. Either avoid that my moving the distances or timing apart, or actually allow a recatch.
Being a catch this might also be better on D>J to accompany the counter grab on DvJ instead of being mixed with the kicks and punches.

The two special kicks connect pretty nicely to the D^A. Even more awesome would be a D^A+D^A+D>A combo.
Also I could totally see the DvA having both an aerial and a ground (sliding) version.

Here is an edit of the D^A:

Most important is ditching the frame with the rising fist where his feet are still both glued to the ground. Such a frame always implies that he never really left off, as you usually jump with one leg and rise the other one first (standing with both stretched means all upward energy from the legs is lost). In my edit I choose the front leg to be the kicking one and the back leg as rising first, since that's where he can get the most push for the punch. After that I only changed his head movement a little and added a relaxation frame. Only the 3 frames in the center are edited, first and last are the original start and the back dash.

[支倉凍砂]

The 3 run attack punches are very risky with the auto linking, better have the player connect them manually by pressing attack.

Roger.

The aerial punching seems to be starting with a hurt frame that doesn't fit very well into the animation.

You know what, I noticed that yesterday too, and I have no idea why.

And while the new jump attack follows very well onto the D^A (I like how you can turn and punch him back) putting two extra punches in between doesn't push the opponent far enough.

Noticed that now. I haven't checked the hitbox for the new punch either, and I'm pretty sure I need to do that too.

The D^A itself looks better now, but he pulls his arm back to his body way too soon to stay stiff in the last frame until he lands. Maybe increase the wait on some of the frames so the animation is better distributed over the whole jump.

I've edited using your sprites.

The dash attacks rest is too low and the knock down property seems weird. If you dash attack Louis it will first hit his armor and then knock him straight to the ground. Better give it a forward momentum, the same direction as the dash itself.

Do you mean "the dash attacks" as in "the dash attack's" or the "dash attacks'"?
I guess you mean the prior and changed "arest: 6" to "vrest: 15". Nothing wrong with your dash attack hitting multiple opponents, right?

Phantom Dash controls great now. At such high speed you should try to adjust the catching itr as precisely as possible as you sometimes catch your opponent from behind, which makes you turn.

Yeah, I've noticed that is a scary high percentage when you turn. How do you go on about fixing that? Making sure the itr is only in front of Walker's body?

Also the throw and the distance could use some adjustment. If you perform two in a row you will currently get hit by the thrown opponent. Either avoid that my moving the distances or timing apart, or actually allow a recatch.

Recatch? Do you mean there actually is a way to catch an opponent in state 12? o_o

Being a catch this might also be better on D>J to accompany the counter grab on DvJ instead of being mixed with the kicks and punches.

There is a reason why I avoid D>J. LF2 isn't built for using special commands in the air and there is in fact a bug I discovered with this.
If you input a special command in the air by pressing all the buttons at the same time rather than after each other (i.e. D+↑+A, instead of D↑A), and then actually perform a move in the air, when you land the game will still read it as you have pressed D as long as you don't press A again. (you might need to hold the D+↑+A for the bug to occur)
Which means if you do J, D+↑+A, →, J you will activate D→J. I don't think this is good as you might want to jump after opponents after doing the air specials.

The two special kicks connect pretty nicely to the D^A. Even more awesome would be a D^A+D^A+D>A combo.

Do you mean "D^A, JD^A, DvA" or do you have even greater plans?

Also I could totally see the DvA having both an aerial and a ground (sliding) version.

Like he powers up, and the glide kicks? (Unblockable because it is too low to block? XD)
On hit can go to uppercut?
Should it multihit also, similar to Louis Thunderkick?

[YinYin]

Do you mean "the dash attacks" as in "the dash attack's" or the "dash attacks'"?
I guess you mean the prior and changed "arest: 6" to "vrest: 15". Nothing wrong with your dash attack hitting multiple opponents, right?

Nothing wrong with a vrest there, no. I prefer my possessive s without apostrophe. If I meant plural I would've also said "rests".

Yeah, I've noticed that is a scary high percentage when you turn. How do you go on about fixing that? Making sure the itr is only in front of Walker's body?

Yes. What you really have to make sure while doing that is that the itr cannot interact with a character who has his center behind Walker.

Recatch? Do you mean there actually is a way to catch an opponent in state 12?

Yes, increase the fall value of the itr, like any other itr that is supposed to hit a state 12 opponent.

There is a reason why I avoid D>J. LF2 isn't built for using special commands in the air and there is in fact a bug I discovered with this.
If you input a special command in the air by pressing all the buttons at the same time rather than after each other (i.e. D+↑+A, instead of D↑A), and then actually perform a move in the air, when you land the game will still read it as you have pressed D as long as you don't press A again. (you might need to hold the D+↑+A for the bug to occur)
Which means if you do J, D+↑+A, →, J you will activate D→J. I don't think this is good as you might want to jump after opponents after doing the air specials.

Yes, I know about this. And I actually like abusing it for combos such as Woodys D>A+J (performs D>A+D>J). And since you can easily cancel these kind of things by pushing just one button (a direction will do) it's not a big deal to me. You have plenty of time to do that before you land. I would still prefer the same kind of moves to end on the same button.

edit: also LF2 is build for aerial specials, even though only Woodys teleports use that.

On that note I now do have some suggestions on the names. As the previous ground/aerial grouping was a good idea I think you can again group them very well by type:

The grappling moves:
Phantom Dash (PD)
Phantom Guard (PG, Spooky sounds a little silly)

The upwards moves:
Spectre Punch (SP, I prefer Spectre over Ghost - but naming both Ghost would be fine too)
Spectre Kick (SK)

The forward kicks:
Dive Kick (DK, Wraith sounds a bit too powerful for this kick in my opinion)
Slide Kick (SK, so I would go with something more descriptive for the air and ground version, 'Kick' is the grouping word here)

edit: To not have the SK abbreviation double you might choose Ghost over Spectre

Do you mean "D^A, JD^A, DvA" or do you have even greater plans?

The recatch.

Like he powers up, and the glide kicks? (Unblockable because it is too low to block? XD)
On hit can go to uppercut?
Should it multihit also, similar to Louis Thunderkick?

Yes. A direct uppercut follow would be a long way considering the ending body position and the start of the uppercut are very far apart. The upwards kick right out of it might work instead. To be honest I don't really like the multi hit on it because unlike Louis he only stretches out one leg.

[支倉凍砂]

Yes. What you really have to make sure while doing that is that the itr cannot interact with a character who has his center behind Walker.

I split it into two itr's, with the rear one going into a direction correction frame and it seems to work rather good!

I would still prefer the same kind of moves to end on the same button.

Wouldn't a character without D→A hurt your LF2-soul? O_O

LF2 is build for aerial specials, even though only Woodys teleports use that.

Totally forgot you can actually do that in the air, I stand corrected.

On that note I now do have some suggestions on the names. As the previous ground/aerial grouping was a good idea I think you can again group them very well by type:

The grappling moves:
Phantom Dash (PD)
Phantom Guard (PG, Spooky sounds a little silly)

The upwards moves:
Spectre Punch (SP, I prefer Spectre over Ghost - but naming both Ghost would be fine too)
Spectre Kick (SK)

The forward kicks:
Dive Kick (DK, Wraith sounds a bit too powerful for this kick in my opinion)
Slide Kick (SK, so I would go with something more descriptive for the air and ground version, 'Kick' is the grouping word here)

Aww, I liked the silliness of Spooky Guard. XD
Noted, however.
Did you try out the "hidden" taunt move I added?

To be honest I don't really like the multi hit on it because unlike Louis he only stretches out one leg.

True that. What about adding a spinning animation, like he drills downwards?
Or would you just rather see him go straight through the opponent landing first?

I'm a little skeptical to the ground based kick. Wouldn't it do the same thing as the Phantom Dash? (as in avoiding attacks through low profiling)

Yes, increase the fall value of the itr, like any other itr that is supposed to hit a state 12 opponent.

...

By the Gods! O_O
It actually works! I can swear that the last time I tried my dreams were crushed 'cause I couldn't get it to work.
I thought they had to be burning or frozen!
Wow, just wow...
My life is complete...

[YinYin]

Wouldn't a character without D→A hurt your LF2-soul? O_O

Not at all. The non-projectile D>As of Mark and Knight hurt me more than Bandit, Hunter, Jan and Firzen.

Did you try out the "hidden" taunt move I added?

No, not sure what to look for.

True that. What about adding a spinning animation, like he drills downwards?
Or would you just rather see him go straight through the opponent landing first?

Drilling sounds downright crazy and better suited for a different character. Straight through, landing first or at the same time would be better.

I'm a little skeptical to the ground based kick. Wouldn't it do the same thing as the Phantom Dash? (as in avoiding attacks through low profiling)

The Phantom Dash is a quick catch now. You could remove this property from it and add it to the slide kick, making them two very distinct moves.

edit: Also both the visuals and the input of the slide kick better suit this property than the Phantom Dash.

[支倉凍砂]

Did you try out the "hidden" taunt move I added?

No, not sure what to look for.

I mentioned it in the last patch notes. For the lulz, you can now input D↓A after a succesful counter to perform a taunt, but I would not recommend doing it unless the opponent actually is dead.

Straight through, landing first or at the same time would be better.

You got it, Wraith Kick Mark II complete.

The Phantom Dash is a quick catch now. You could remove this property from it and add it to the slide kick, making them two very distinct moves.
Also both the visuals and the input of the slide kick better suit this property than the Phantom Dash.

Is it so weird if you consider Bat's punch being completely invulnerable?
Though, it might be too strong in its current state. You even can combo it into itself.
Also, D↑A > JD↑A > delay D→J is became possible now!

With the currents itrs for the catch, I have only gotten a reverse throw once unlike 50% or so of the time before.

Slight update: https://www.dropbox.com/s/112pmx1xloot9t....06%5D.rar

[YinYin]

You got it, Wraith Kick Mark II complete.

I liked the angle it had before. It goes too fast and too straight down now.

Is it so weird if you consider Bat's punch being completely invulnerable?
Though, it might be too strong in its current state. You even can combo it into itself.
Also, D↑A > JD↑A > delay D→J is became possible now!

No, not at all. For the beginning or a short time frame inside the Phantom Dash you could have a few frames without a bdy. Just try not to have frames with an itr and no bdy. To be different the slide kick would be quite a bit slower and end in a roll. Both together would be almost like dodging with Henrys cartwheel. A rather long time to evade bigger things, except the first half does have a low bdy that can be hit and an itr.
About the recatch: think of it as something similar to Louis' continuously whirling his enemy around with +J. He can do that as long as he has mana left. Walker at least gives the opponent a chance to flip away.